I need some advice...

[The Starman]

Yes, this really is my first post. I've been lurking here for a while now and had an intention of joining at some point, but just haven't gotten around to it. Well I seem to have found myself in a bit of a predicament as of late, so after getting some conflicting advice from my friends, I decided to ask this question anonymously on a few of the forums that I have been lurking at, perhaps I can receive a more objective response from people who don't know me or the girl I am referring to. I must warn you though, this is a bit of a long read, so I do apologize in advance for the length. Normally I would never go to the internet for advice, let alone dating advice, but I figured 'what the hell, I'll give it a shot,' so here goes.

To start off I'm 20 years old (and so is the girl I like) and I've had very little real experience with relationships. I did date a girl for about six months my junior year of high school, but I don't even consider that a real relationship, since I was an entirely different person back then and I didn't even really feel anything towards her. I'm very selective when it comes to relationships, both in terms of physical appearances and in terms of various personality traits and her intelligence level (which must be high). Some say that I'm "too picky," and perhaps they are right, since I've only really found two women to be truly attractive in the past few years (if not in my entire life).

In early April 2012 I got a new job at a Walmart store that at the time wasn't open yet. I helped set the store up, doing tasks such as unloading freight and stocking shelves. Well I eventually became friends with one of my co-workers, who we shall now refer to as Chris (not his real name). Well one day in early May, just a few days before the store was set to open, Chris introduced me to his best friend, a beautiful young woman who we shall now refer to as Claire (not her real name). I was almost immediately taken in by her beauty, and was extremely nervous, to the point where I hardly said two words the entire time the three of us sat and had lunch for about an hour.

Unfortunately I hadn't seen Claire since that day until about a week and a half later, and she said "hi" to me (and I said "hi" back) as we ran into each other at work. This happened a handful of times over the next few weeks. Eventually I told Chris that I had a crush on her, Chris and I hung out all the time at work at that point and were quickly becoming friends; he told me that I should probably just move on, because apparently Claire "just doesn't do relationships." I asked him what he meant by this, and he told me that he's been her best friend since 6th grade and she's never been in a relationship and has shot down every guy who has ever tried asking her out or made "moves" on her. She is also like me in the sense that she wants to wait until she meets the right person and fall in love with him (or in my case, her) before having sex. However, unlike me, she is a fairly hardcore Christian, whereas I am an agnostic atheist. When I say "hardcore Christian," I do not mean that she is a Christian fundamentalist or homophobic or anything like that, but she does take her faith seriously.

I listened to what Chris had to say, but I was not dissuaded in the least. I ran into Claire a few times in the break room since then, and we talked, we got to know each other somewhat. We have a lot in common, we're both pretty big geeks and we love Japanese culture, anime, reading, guns, video games, etc. We both have similar political views, as we are both conservatives, and we spoke about politics a few times, and we shared our disgust with how Obama and the Democrats are taking us down the same road as the socialists in the European Union. She even recommended me a book, which I haven't gotten around to checking out yet because ano

Well one day one of my co-workers, who shall now refer to as Leon (not his real name), was talking about the girls that he likes; he then proceeded to ask me if I "have the hots for" anyone at the moment. To which I responded by telling him about Claire, and I mentioned that she was really quiet all of the time. Leon then started talking about how "oh I could carry a conversation with her easily," since apparently he is a "stud" (right...), so I bet him $10 that he couldn't. A few hours later Leon approached me and said "I talked to her, she likes books" then he asked for the $10. I'm a fair and honest man, so I gave him the $10. I later learned that his "conversation" with her consisted of him sitting next to her for about 15 minutes and trying to talk to her while she was reading a book on break, and barely responded to him at all.

Leon, being the only 16 year old who works at our Walmart, then proceeded to brag to everyone about how he "won $10" by making a bet with me about talking to Claire. I needed to get on damage control quickly, for this rumor was spreading quickly. Leon and I were on break and so we went to find Claire, I was hoping that I could talk to her before she found out via a third party. When we found her, I asked her if she heard anything about a bet that Leon and I had had or anything like that, and said she did hear about a bet; she however did not hear that I liked her, so we didn't mention that. I swear she had the most puzzled look on her face, she probably thought we were making fun of her because she hardly ever talks and because she probably thought we're just two stupid football jocks who are picking on her. I said I was so sorry, and I meant every word of it, I didn't explain why we made the bet though. She was visible confused and embarrassed, so Leon and I left; I swear I felt like such an idiot, and I did make a stupid mistake, I don't know what I was thinking when I made that bet.

About two hours later, I was getting ready to go home and so I went in the break room and... OH MY GOD! She was there, sitting down at a table by herself. I sat next to her and I told her the truth, the whole truth. Perhaps I was a little to honest, since I didn't leave out things that a more savvy individual probably would have kept to himself. I told her about how ever since I laid eyes on her that I thought she was beautiful and how I've had a crush on her for the past month. I swear, her whole face just lit up when I said that, and she had a look on her face that read of surprise. I also explained that I was stupid for making the bet with Leon, and that I was sorry. I told her that I shouldn't have ever made that stupid bet with him, to which she responded "in the future you probably shouldn't do that." Things were great, I left her alone for a while and finished getting ready to go home after a nine hour shift of pushing carts in the summer heat. I really thought things were going to work out, we had a great heart-to-heart and I felt like I really turned things around.

And that lasted for about five minutes until I walked out of the door and ran into Leon. I told him about how I think things are going to work out between Claire and me after all and that I was so happy. About thirty seconds later Claire walked out the same door I did and ran into Leon and me. What happened next can only be described as the most anti-climatic event that has ever happened in my entire life. Leon walked in front of her and stopped her from going any further, he then started talking about me, telling her how I'm "such a great guy" and he literally begged her to go out with me. At that point I pretty much just turned to jelly and just slid down the wall I was leaning against on to the floor in a heap, thinking to myself "OH FU-------------." As Leon was begging her to go out with me, I was begging Leon to "stop" and to "leave her alone," but he wouldn't listen to my pleas. He literally asked her to go on a date with me about 30 times, and she said "let's try being friends first and see where that goes." But that wasn't the end of it, Leon then asked her to give me her number, and when she refused, he then asked for her to add me on Facebook (and add him too). After he asked her about five times, she finally wrote down her full name and gave him the paper, saying "fine, you can look me up, now I need to get back to work, so please step aside." He finally stepped aside and let her leave, during this time I was still sitting on the floor, my back to the wall, thinking "what the hell just happened?" I then had a few words with Leon, telling him that he shouldn't have done that and that she'll probably never talk to me again (even though I had nothing to do with Leon doing this, and even tried to stop him). Leon, seeing nothing wrong in what he had just did, replied with "dude I got you her Facebook, you should be thanking me, I got you the girl!" I just walked away at that point, words could not describe how I felt and I was still trying to process and collate everything that had just happened.

From that point on Claire thought I was a creep, despite me having nothing to do with Leon's crazed outburst. A few days after the incident, I approached Claire and tried to apologize, I felt so bad about what had happened; I told her that I had nothing to do with the way Leon was behaving, but I don't think she believed me. I have no doubt that in Leon's mind, he honestly thought he was helping and he had his heart in the right place; it took a couple of weeks, but I eventually forgave Leon. A few weeks after the incident, Chris, knowing that I was innocent in this, talked to Claire and he told me that Claire told him that she wants to give me a second chance and be friends, but that I should give her a little time. So that's what I did, I didn't even talk to her for about a month, then one day I tried asking her how she's been and I felt like she was just ignoring me, though there is a possibility that she just didn't hear me, since I was a few meters away at the time and we were both in the middle of doing our own separate tasks.

About a month after the day that Leon had his outburst, Leon had suggested that each of us cartpushers should write an autobiography about our lives and jobs here at Walmart, and we could publish it in a book. Needless to say, I was skeptical, but I went along with it since everyone else was and I thought it might help me better understand myself. So I wrote about everything that happened, for the first month that I worked for Walmart, including the day that I met Claire. I didn't say anything too weird or creepy, just that I had a crush on her and that I was extremely nervous around her. After that point, I decided to turn it into a zombie apocalypse story, and it was quite good. There were no other references to Claire in it at all, aside from one small paragraph where her and Chris worked together to survive the initial zombie outbreak and fought alongside Leon and myself.

In fact, there were no references to any romance between any of the characters. I eventually showed Chris and Leon it and they thought it was great, so I shared it around to a couple other people, and those people told their friends about it, and their friends told their friends about it, and their friends told their friends about it; so on and so forth. Well by the time Claire finally heard about it, the real story was completely distorted and apparently she thought that it was a romance story involving me and her. It's like that game "telephone," where the original message is passed on so many times that it loses parts of the truth each time it is passed down.

Chris, having read the actual story, talked to Claire about it and told her that there was nothing even close to that. He told her that the only reason her name (as well as the names of several other Walmart employees) was mention in it, was because it was supposed to be a story of what would happen if a zombie outbreak occurred while we were all working at Walmart. I didn't actually hear what Chris and Claire talked about, since I was in the next room; but when Chris came out he said that I should just "move on and forget about Claire." Chris is the closest person I have to a best friend, so I took his advice and tried moving on. I haven't spoken to Claire in about a month, but we still run into each other all of the time at work and I still really like her.

Well two days ago I was talking to a co-worker, a young woman in her mid-twenties who I cashier with frequently. One topic led to another and I mentioned Claire. She knew that I had a crush on her forever, and she was wondering why Claire didn't like me. Apparently I'm "cute" and a "great guy," or so my co-worker told me, and so I explained everything that had happened, and she said that I shouldn't give up so easily, and that I should keep pursuing her. I remained skeptical, but I said I would think about what she told me, and what she was saying made a lot of sense, but I still needed time to think about it.

Yesterday Leon and I were trying to find one of the head-honcho managers for about 20 minutes, so we asked our supervisor if she could ask for him over the radio, and she said she didn't have a radio at the time and that we should try asking Claire, because she has a radio on her. Well we walked over to Claire and I talked to her for the first time in like five weeks, and things weren't so awkward or bad, she helped us out and was very friendly. I am beginning to think that perhaps my co-worker was right in saying that I shouldn't just give up, and Claire seems to have forgiven me? All I want is another chance, even if just to be friends; I've learned from my mistakes and I feel confident that I can can turn things around. What do you guys think I should do?

Edited July 19, 2012 by The Starman

[RikuoAmero]

Hmm...okay, just to warn you, I've never dated in my life (well, went out once with a girl, I considered it a date, she didn't, but we did have fun, didn't lead anywhere though)

So...reading through this, is this Claire's personality? Cool and professional while working, but somewhat distant and a little cold when acting personally? Cause if so, disregard how she acts when you and her are doing something work related. I'm the same way, I can be in a team at work with someone I despise and be completely professional to the point the other person doesn't know how I feel. So, if she is like that, how she acts professionally doesn't factor into the Romance-O-Meter at all, if you get my meaning.

You don't need me warning you, but be careful about her, since you're both employees of the same company. If she were to complain to management of sexual harassment, your ass would be out on the street. You wouldn't be able to fight back against such a claim, since management would think its financially safer to just get rid of you at the get-go, rather than have Claire sue them for not protecting her from you (not saying you are a harasser, saying this is how management thinks).

Given that I'm a romantic at heart, I'd say be careful but risk it one more. Literally one more time. Tell your friends to back off, especially Leon, he sounds like a complete asshole for not stopping when you were repeatedly shouting at him to. If he turns up while you're chatting to her, say "Excuse me", then physically chuck him out. Don't entertain his presence at all while you're chatting to Claire, at least not until you're officially BF and GF.

When chatting to Claire, try and find something to do that the both of you can enjoy. If she brings up her Christian beliefs about waiting until marriage, try and think of the nicest way possible of saying the following

1) No-one starts as husband and wife. They have to go through the boyfriend/girlfriend phase first.

2) If she is adamant about abstinence until marriage, then agree with her. Say you highly respect her and make an oath, a promise to abide by it. You're not in it for the sex, from what you've written, you genuinely like her. Make sure she understands that.

Also be careful about what you say about her around your workmates. EXTREMELY careful. Even your zombie story, that had no romance in it, almost completely blew your chances. If someone starts dissing her, don't laugh along. Defend her. When around people both you and she knows, act like every single move you make is being carefully recorded, and reported to her.

If somehow you blow it again with her, then dude, seriously, drop her. Your job will be at major risk then, as word will get around that you just don't take no for an answer, that you're harassing the female employees.

[Alice]

Speaking from a female's-point-of-view, I would agree with your co-worker that told you not to give up hope. From the sounds of it she has forgiven you. Start over fresh with her. From the sounds of it, she is the type of girl who wants to find real love and wants dedication. So show your dedication...start slow. Make small talk with her and find out more about her. I will tell you this, it will probably take you quite a bit of time to win her over. But showing your determination and your will to wait and make it work should help you immensely. I am also a girl who is not easily taken in. Good luck and I hope it works out for you.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Sakura Rei

[coffeeNiK]

Right now, you have to bridge that estranged gap you have. If you keep putting your thoughts at the level of gf/bf it's not going to work out because all of your conversations would be awkward like that.

Be polite, observe and try to make conversation whenever you get a chance. I really cannot stress RikuoAmero's harrasment point....

[† L4ugh]

I had something similar to this happen to me while I worked at Wal-Mart, and I would "Strongly" urge you to look out for what Rikuo said. They could replace you in less then a day and would take no issue in doing so.

Personally, I would take a hybrid approach. Give up on it being gf/bf and just try to be friends with her. I would give it another month or two before you even try that though. It sounds to me like you're asking advice from multiple co-workers about what you should do in regards to this girl. That really isn't a good idea. She is most likely hearing about at least some of these conversations, and this will only leave her with the opinion that you're obsessed with her. You should cut off all discussion of her with anyone you work with except for maybe the Chris person.

I would try to expand your friendship with Chris, and not just to get closer to her. He seems to be willing to stick his neck out for you with a friend he's known a lot longer. Sounds like a damn good friend in my book. Don't ask about her all time when you're with him either, it will just make him feel used. If he really is close to her, then the better friends the two you become will likely make her more willing to let you back in. When/if that time every comes, she will more then likely let you know. Just don't be an idiot and miss the signal.

If you do get another chance, start slow. Try to set up group activities with people that both of you get along with. Something that involves more then just you, her, and Chris. Try to make her feel like just another person in the group, while also becoming closer friends with her. Then just slowly whittle the group down until she is comfortable with it being just the two of you. If that day never comes, then it isn't meant to be. Except the two friends you made out of it and move on. I wouldn't pass on other opportunities that come alone either. If another girl you like comes alone, give her a chance. You might find that you're over the other one.

You're still young, don't allow yourself to get stuck on one girl. If you do, you'll likely miss out on a lot of others you never even knew you had a chance with.

[BlackDahlia]

I'm going to have to disagree with the first few posts. I may sound like an ass and it's probably not what you want to hear, but you asked for strangers' advice so I'm telling you what I believe.

I say it's time to move on. As I was reading it, I saw many, many signs that should tell you to move on. And then I got to this sentence "All I want is another chance, even if just to be friends." That's the final sign that you should move on. Why? Well, because it's complete bs. No one tries that hard to make a friend. No one thinks "I just want another chance to see if we can be friends" to someone of the same sex when you've known them for so little. Why is someone of the opposite sex any different? The only reason you say that is because you have put her on a pedestal and are not over her.

It seems to me like you will never really be satisfied even if you two were friends. You will always want something more. All you're really doing by pursuing this any further is stressing yourself out, you're probably really anxious, your health probably slowly declining, and most importantly, wasting your time. No girl is worth investing this much time into when you're getting to know her. Not even the one that seems "perfect." Not only that, but the amount of effort you're putting into it is ridiculous. Sounds like it would be a one sided relationship. She knows you like her, what more can you do? To keep trying to sweep her off her feet at this point is dumb. She can take it or leave it. If she takes it, good for you. If she doesn't, sucks for her.

Bottom line, I don't think any girl is worth putting this much effort into at this point of her being in your life. I'm sure there are people who will disagree with what I've said. Everyone wants to believe that you should never give up; you will eventually get the girl/guy. I think that when you find someone who is worth your time, you will not have to go through all this crap and not even have a date to show for it.

That's my advice. But at the end of the day, you can do whatever you want.

Edited July 20, 2012 by BlackDahlia

[NineTailed]

I say move on , no point in trying if things just dont seem yo work, and whay rikuo said is rlly helpful otherwise.

[† Mute point]

I'm kindof confused at all of this. To be honest, the whole thing sounds like the plot for a (very bad) romance novel.

First: Leon should have gotten punched in the face for creeping like that.

Second: How does a fictional zombie apocalypse story fit with an autobiography?

Third: Stop obessing. If you want to be her friend and maybe have a shot later, then be her friend. Otherwise, stop creeping, and start helping customers, because every walmart I've been to has had "that guy" who ignores every customer except the ones he knows, and if you're that guy, I'd fire you.

[The Starman]

Thank you everyone for the advice, however I think I'm just going to move on and not talk to Claire anymore. Perhaps in the distant future her and I will be friends, but for now I'm just going to get on with my life. I can proudly say though, that I have learned a lot from this experience.

[† Emotional Outlet]

Haha, glad you came back. I read the thread and saw you hadn't returned in a while, so I was reluctant to make a reply. I think moving on and letting her go is probably the best course of action for a lot of the same reasons mentioned above. Glad it turned out okay for you, though!

[Kasoivc]

But that's so sad! I can sympathize with the OP's situation :[ Me, myself. I'm a hopeless romantic. Actually scratch that, I'm just hopeless. I don't feel much of a romancer as I am a hopeless individual. I've had 2-3 whole relationships over a course of 19 years, which took part mostly in the past 3 years.

Shrugs, moving on is the hardest thing ever for someone to do. Not just in relationships, but the death of someone, or something - because you sit there in your dark hole, holding yourself accountable, tormenting yourself until you recieve the "answer" you wanted to hear. I find lately that with each breakup, I become moreso less caring about the fact that it "ended". Yeah, it does hurt like hell to come to the realization "Oh... It's over" but the fact that you can realize that and probably retain zero mental damage, probably means for the better.

I applaud you for being able to move on, but it doesn't hurt to keep her in the very back of your mind while you move on with life. The very back, you can keep her buried underneath your other priorities, but just remember she's back there and that you did have feelings for her at one point. That'll help you to retain that fresh slate, without thinking too much about the situation, or the past.

Oh. F.y.i. Work relationships; Even harder to maintain than a long distance relationship imho. I had the hots for a girl that I worked with, took her to Prom even, but I was shot down when I asked if she was interested in a relationship, no big deal Gotta keep your head up 'mate!