Animelist + Recommend My Next Viewing / Discuss Scores in Trivially Superfluous Debate

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So I'm horribly indecisive right now and can't pick my next show to watch. Here's my MAL, or graph if you prefer, feel free to pick anything that either has a finished English dub or is not likely to get one in the future. Or if you have something not on the list you think I'd like, that works too.

 

Or just hop into the thread and feel free to poke me on any scores I've picked. I'm an obsessive snob and enjoy debating the quality of a series, and I stand by most (if not all, some on shows I watched a long time ago may be off due to recalculating my scale a few times) of my scores here. 

edit: to head off a possible question: I don't score movies/specials unless they're actually extending the story of a full series, since grading them on the same scale as an episodic show is awkward.

 

that said: I tend to try and score based on a critical view as opposed to my own personal enjoyment. eg: you may have noticed me obsessing about Symphogear in other threads, yet I rated it a 5 (and 6 for the newest season). 

 

 

If you do decide to engage in critical combat, do keep it civil, and remember that numbered scores are mostly meaningless anyway and categorisation is silly and all that jazz. Also that source material is irrelevant, what actually makes it into the anime and on screen is what should be judged in this context.

Edited July 4, 2016 by Catar

[Moodkiller]

Duuuude, you haven't watched Noragami and Tokyo Ghoul Root A yet? 

 

Would definitely go with those 2 next, possibly Tokyo Ghoul first and then Noragami becuase it would set the expectation too high  Not to mention that you have both seasons of Noragami available dubbed! 

[Catar]

49 minutes ago, Moodkiller said:

Duuuude, you haven't watched Noragami and Tokyo Ghoul Root A yet? 

 

Would definitely go with those 2 next, possibly Tokyo Ghoul first and then Noragami becuase it would set the expectation too high  Not to mention that you have both seasons of Noragami available dubbed! 

See, I didn't like Tokyo Ghoul that much (5/10), so I wasn't particularly motivated to hit up the second season yet. It's only 12 episodes though, so I suppose I'll drop it in after I finish up Shiki, my only real active show right now. (The rest of my currently watching list is either stuff friends are forcing me to watch or long-term watches)

 

I've really only been watching anime for about a year, excepting Ghibli/Cowboy Bebop. I'm sure there's a lot I'm missing.

[JayDee]

1 hour ago, Catar said:

that said: I tend to try and score based on a critical view as opposed to my own personal enjoyment. eg: you may have noticed me obsessing about Symphogear in other threads, yet I rated it a 5 (and 6 for the newest season). 

 

 

 

And what would be the need for the two opposing views of a show? If you go about obsessing over a show, it would seem to me that you really like it so why doesn't your score reflect that? If it was really just a run of the mill show then why don't you feel that way about it?  My guess is that you picked up this "critical" stuff from elsewhere. If it's possible that a show you scored 5 or below( average-bad ) was enjoyable enough to obsessive over then it's possible to think that a 10/10 was immensely boring and/or not worth talking about. Does that sound right? 

 

I'd recommend Bakemonogatari next btw and if you can't get behind that series then give Katanagatari a shot.

Edited July 4, 2016 by JayDee
because...

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Just now, JayDee said:

And what would be the need for the two opposing views of a show? If you go about obsessing over a show, it would seem to me that you really like it so why doesn't your score reflect that? If it was really just a run of the mill show then why don't you feel that way about it?  My guess is that you picked up this "critical" stuff from elsewhere. If it's possible that a show you scored 5 or below( average-bad ) was enjoyable enough to obsessive over then it's possible to think that a 10/10 was immensely boring and not worth talking about. Does that sound right? 

 

I'd recommend Bakemonogatari next btw and if you can't get behind that series then give Katanagatari a shot.

 

 

re: critical view vs enjoyment: There is such a thing as a guilty pleasure, i.e. something I recognise as awful and uncreative but still enjoy (S Y M P H O G E A R, Btooom, others down in my 5/10 and below). Then there's something thoroughly unique that can even follow through on its concept and yet still not end up being particularly well edited/written/etc. (Serial Experiments Lain springs to mind, something I dearly wanted to love as I'm a huge fan of cyberpunk, but the pacing is awful, the writing is weak and the episodes become increasingly incoherent toward the end).

 

In my opinion, for something to be critically strong, it should be enjoyable and fulfill the more critical aspects. Thus, Cowboy Bebop sitting comfortably on top, being both a fun western in space with bounty hunters, adventures, and an enjoyable laid-back atmosphere, while still hitting strong on the critical side with well-edited and choreographed fights, a fascinating musical theme centerpiece that sharpens the direction of each individual episode, and true standout pieces like Pierrot Le Fou (That episode alone could push Cowboy Bebop to 9/10).

 

re: Bakemonogatari: I've been meaning to watch it for a long time, but for it to work in Plex or my media center (Kodi-based, but modified), I need a version without ordered chapters. Coalgirls is the only high quality version I've found, and my efforts to unlink the MKVs into single packages have not gone well =(

[Moodkiller]

24 minutes ago, Catar said:

1 hour ago, Moodkiller said:

Duuuude, you haven't watched Noragami and Tokyo Ghoul Root A yet? 

 

Would definitely go with those 2 next, possibly Tokyo Ghoul first and then Noragami becuase it would set the expectation too high  Not to mention that you have both seasons of Noragami available dubbed! 

See, I didn't like Tokyo Ghoul that much (5/10), so I wasn't particularly motivated to hit up the second season yet. It's only 12 episodes though, so I suppose I'll drop it in after I finish up Shiki, my only real active show right now. (The rest of my currently watching list is either stuff friends are forcing me to watch or long-term watches)

 

I've really only been watching anime for about a year, excepting Ghibli/Cowboy Bebop. I'm sure there's a lot I'm missing.

Oh interesting, I dont know what you have heard about Root A, but all I can say is give it a chance... I hated it in the beginning I'll admit. Haha sounds about right, Im glad to see you have at least seen Toradora!

 

Anyone who hasnt see every anime out there must be missing out  

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2 minutes ago, Moodkiller said:

Oh interesting, I dont know what you have heard about Root A, but all I can say is give it a chance... I hated it in the beginning I'll admit. Haha sounds about right, Im glad to see you have at least seen Toradora!

 

Anyone who hasnt see every anime out there must be missing out  

Toradora I have loved more each time I've watched it (three total now). English every time, but really the dub is a standout. Which I understand is kind of surprising since NIS rarely does dubs, and did this one like 4+ years after Toradora originally came out.

 

Toradora spoilers:

Spoiler

I do have a theory though that Minori was intended to actually be in love with Taiga as well, as opposed to Ryuuji. It's hinted at multiple times, including explicitly once by Minori herself, and it holds true throughout the series right up to the chase out of the school near the end. In fact, that chase (and the Mr. Luckyman race) make more sense to me if you consider them to both have a crush on her. In addition, this further explains Minori's awkwardness around Ryuuji once she discovers his crush; given her more direct nature, it seemed a bit out of character for her to suddenly clam up on finding this out as opposed to talking it out with her best friend. If you instead recognise that she simply doesn't return his advances because she's in love with Taiga and recognises that Taiga is in love with him, her gentle rejection on Christmas Eve both makes more sense and is put into a more tragic light. 

 

Instead we get a last second swerve where Minori is suddenly in love with Ryuuji as well, and the briefest of love triangles before the ending. Also the last episode drama rush where Taiga suddenly vanished without a word was a bit overboard, in my opinion, but not out of character for Taiga's impulsiveness, so I'll let that one slide >.>

 

[Moodkiller]

41 minutes ago, Catar said:

Toradora I have loved more each time I've watched it (three total now). English every time, but really the dub is a standout. Which I understand is kind of surprising since NIS rarely does dubs, and did this one like 4+ years after Toradora originally came out.

 

Toradora spoilers:

  Hide contents

I do have a theory though that Minori was intended to actually be in love with Taiga as well, as opposed to Ryuuji. It's hinted at multiple times, including explicitly once by Minori herself, and it holds true throughout the series right up to the chase out of the school near the end. In fact, that chase (and the Mr. Luckyman race) make more sense to me if you consider them to both have a crush on her. In addition, this further explains Minori's awkwardness around Ryuuji once she discovers his crush; given her more direct nature, it seemed a bit out of character for her to suddenly clam up on finding this out as opposed to talking it out with her best friend. If you instead recognise that she simply doesn't return his advances because she's in love with Taiga and recognises that Taiga is in love with him, her gentle rejection on Christmas Eve both makes more sense and is put into a more tragic light. 

 

Instead we get a last second swerve where Minori is suddenly in love with Ryuuji as well, and the briefest of love triangles before the ending. Also the last episode drama rush where Taiga suddenly vanished without a word was a bit overboard, in my opinion, but not out of character for Taiga's impulsiveness, so I'll let that one slide >.>

 

Hahaha same here! Though I had to watch it for QC reasons, but I'm glad I did... enjoyed it every time. One of the BEST, most natural voice acting I've ever come across.  One thing that still annoys me is Horriblesubs released a DUB as we were working on ours! I mean out of all their series.... why??

 

 

Spoiler

 

I do have a theory though that Minori was intended to actually be in love with Taiga as well..

Ok what the hell! Mind officially blown... Im going to have to re watch it loaded with that bit of info. That does make a lot of sense, though I am glad that they didnt make that obvious in the series... I have a feeling that would have ruined it for me. I was prepared for the Taiga > Ryuuji couple and then Minori > Kitamura at the end. 

Plot twist, Kitamura also loves Ryuuji... 

 

 

 

I have not found anything that come close to it, nor to give me the feelings that Toradora did. So good for an "old" anime. 

[Catar]

13 hours ago, Moodkiller said:

Hahaha same here! Though I had to watch it for QC reasons, but I'm glad I did... enjoyed it every time. One of the BEST, most natural voice acting I've ever come across.  One thing that still annoys me is Horriblesubs released a DUB as we were working on ours! I mean out of all their series.... why??

 

Maybe they recognised just how good the dub was. Who knows?

 

Cassandra Lee Morris was revelatory though. Not only that, but she shot off to the other end of the spectrum and played Kyuubey very well in Madoka. One of the few shows I actually watched subtitled first, then dubbed. Also great as Patema in Patema Inverted, and Amy in Gargantia.

[Moodkiller]

On 7/5/2016 at 5:24 AM, Catar said:

 

Maybe they recognised just how good the dub was. Who knows?

 

Cassandra Lee Morris was revelatory though. Not only that, but she shot off to the other end of the spectrum and played Kyuubey very well in Madoka. One of the few shows I actually watched subtitled first, then dubbed. Also great as Patema in Patema Inverted, and Amy in Gargantia.

Haha, quite possibly... or the fact that no one had release it yet even though the USBD had been out for a while.

 

Ahh her personality and attitude was incredible, her voice suited Taiga perfectly! Lets not forget Leafa from SAO as well in that list, but I don't think that was anything too wow there. Ritsu from K-On! would be a better example...  I'll have to wait for you to watch that one though. 

[Catar]

11 hours ago, Moodkiller said:

Haha, quite possibly... or the fact that no one had release it yet even though the USBD had been out for a while.

 

Ahh her personality and attitude was incredible, her voice suited Taiga perfectly! Lets not forget Leafa from SAO as well in that list, but I don't think that was anything too wow there. Ritsu from K-On! would be a better example...  I'll have to wait for you to watch that one though. 

 

While she's perfectly fine as Suguha/Leafa in SAO, it doesn't help that the writing demands she be overly melodramatic. She handles it fine, but SAO is so poorly written that there's really not much for her to do with the material; she doesn't have nearly as interesting a character to work with as Taiga.

 

K-On is on my server now, I'll be getting around to it sooner or later.

[Moodkiller]

On 7/11/2016 at 7:55 AM, Catar said:

 

While she's perfectly fine as Suguha/Leafa in SAO, it doesn't help that the writing demands she be overly melodramatic. She handles it fine, but SAO is so poorly written that there's really not much for her to do with the material; she doesn't have nearly as interesting a character to work with as Taiga.

Eh, fair point. Taiga is best girl anyways

 

On 7/11/2016 at 7:55 AM, Catar said:

K-On is on my server now, I'll be getting around to it sooner or later.

Glad to hear! Great "starting" anime into the music genre.

 

I'll have to have a look through your list again to see what others I think would be worthwhile starting now.  

[Catar]

16 minutes ago, Moodkiller said:

Glad to hear! Great "starting" anime into the music genre.

 

I'll have to have a look through your list again to see what others I think would be worthwhile starting now.  

 

Assuming you consider Beck part of the music genre, I've already had at least one entrypoint. Might be a bit different from the rest though, given its primary focus on a indie rock band as opposed to the more common light music club stuff I usually see floating around. I'm not too huge on most school-based anime (toradora obvious exception); unless the school plots actually go somewhere interesting and aren't solely focused on the school event in question, I get very bored very quickly (See Shana S02 :\ )

 

I've started on Tokyo Ghoul S02 now, three episodes in. Still a pretty bland show, and I have serious issues with the MC; I feel like he's actively contradictory and poorly written, and there are weird contrivances surrounding his abilities that are inconsistent with the rest of the series on important plot levels, not just nitpick levels. To be fair though, I could be mis-remembering the first season, I watched it a good while ago. The OP sure is a letdown compared to S01.

 

but hey, at least it's pretty good looking.

[Moodkiller]

1 minute ago, Catar said:

 

Assuming you consider Beck part of the music genre, I've already had at least one entrypoint. Might be a bit different from the rest though, given its primary focus on a indie rock band as opposed to the more common light music club stuff I usually see floating around. I'm not too huge on most school-based anime (toradora obvious exception); unless the school plots actually go somewhere interesting and aren't solely focused on the school event in question, I get very bored very quickly (See Shana S02 :\ )

 

I've started on Tokyo Ghoul S02 now, three episodes in. Still a pretty bland show, and I have serious issues with the MC; I feel like he's actively contradictory and poorly written, and there are weird contrivances surrounding his abilities that are inconsistent with the rest of the series on important plot levels, not just nitpick levels. To be fair though, I could be mis-remembering the first season, I watched it a good while ago. The OP sure is a letdown compared to S01.

 

but hey, at least it's pretty good looking.

Yeah I do, hence why I also put the word starting in quotation marks - Cant remember from your list (read, too lazy to go back now), but have you seen Angel Beats? That plot definitely went somewhere. 

 

Yup, I know exactly how you feel... I was considering even stopping and rewatching season 1, but the perseverance paid off in the end. I had to skip the OP each time, I think I just watched it on Ep11 to remember why I had skipped it. The ED is at least a lot better!

[Catar]

2 minutes ago, Moodkiller said:

Yeah I do, hence why I also put the word starting in quotation marks - Cant remember from your list (read, too lazy to go back now), but have you seen Angel Beats? That plot definitely went somewhere. 

 

I barely consider Angel Beats a school show. A school is the setting, sure, but when I talk about school shows I'm more referring to ones that pretty strictly adhere to the Japanese school system as a plot structure, down to following the school year, making sure to give big episode arcs to culture festivals, spending a lot of drama on things like school councils and elections, classroom drama and lessons and what-have-you.

 

This is definitely more of a personal dislike than a critical one though. I have a double-bias here against school-focused plots, since I didn't go to school in Japan (vastly different school culture than NA), and I'm quite a few years removed from high school at this point. I have no real connection to any school-specific plots unless they actually have significance to characters I'm actually interested in, but since so many characters get characterised solely by their position in school, all of them fall flat pretty quickly. 

 

I hate to bring up Toradora yet again, but since it's so relevant here as a show I think did this right: Note that Toradora very specifically introduces a lot of its important characters in ways that have nothing to do with school, despite being a show that wholly commits to the setting and structure I just described. Ryuuji and Taiga obviously, but even Kitamura is introduced as Ryuuji's best friend and one of the only people who isn't afraid of him, as well as Taiga's love interest, well before it's noted that he's also the VP of the student council. Minori follows this trend (Taiga's best friend, airhead, bit crazy, only noted as the softball captain after being established as a character). 

 

Honestly though, this is more of just a trend of weak characterisation that's everywhere in anime (and quite frequent in western media too), where characters are solely defined by their position or job or whatnot and don't actually have personalities. 

 

to loop back around Angel Beats though, I liked it, but I felt it needed more episodes for the number of characters it had, and that the comedy was too slapstick and non-sequitur to mesh well with the drama they wanted. Less characters and more time for individuals to get real arcs and it could have really been great.

[Catar]

On 7/3/2016 at 6:13 PM, Moodkiller said:

Duuuude, you haven't watched Noragami and Tokyo Ghoul Root A yet? 

 

Tokyo Ghoul first and then Noragami

Checking back in. I finished Root A, halfway through Noragami S01.

 

Tokyo Ghoul Rant

Spoiler

 

Root A was... kind of a mess? Frequently incoherent, battles for seemingly no reason that went on way too long, severe lack of characterisation or character development for anyone on the show except Juuzou (great English dub there, incidentally. Slid right along that perfect line between going overboard on the madness voice and staying serious enough to keep verisimilitude). This felt like one of those instances where I was missing a lot by having not read the source material, which makes for a terrible adaptation.

 

I thought it looked pretty good visually though, and some of the second half of the season wasn't as bad. Once they got past the initial four episodes of slugfest, and started bringing in some actual interactions between characters, there was something interesting to watch. The final episode was actually handled fairly well, all things considered. 

 

Mostly though, I was just bored by it. Overall it felt like a weak vampire-twist story without a lot of thought behind it.

 

/end tokyo ghoul rant

 

Re: Noragami:

Spoiler

Much, much better handling of battles so far, and making sure they actually feel connected to character actions and decisions rather than spectacle for spectacle's sake. I'm still not quite sure on this one, but we'll see. Plenty of episodes to go, and I'm enjoying the main trio more than I expected to. I'm hoping that Hiyori gets more to do though, feels weird that she basically dominated the first couple episodes and focus was given to her abilities, her obsession with fighting and the whole spirit divide, yet since then she's been shunted to the sidelines, and where the hell does she keep leaving her body? This actually needs to be answered, it's not really a nitpick. Is she just trusting Yato to take care of it constantly? That's pretty awful of her. Otherwise, are people coming across her collapsed everywhere? Why is no one bringing this up? When you establish that you're in the real world and people are actually noticing this stuff (see episodes 1 and 2), you can't just ditch that line of narrative and expect it to work out okay.

/end noragami rant

[Koby]

From what I understand, seems Tokyo Ghoul veered off into anime-original by the end of S1, which left S2 pretty much all anime-original, or in other words basically filler. Now don't hold me to that as I haven't read the source material nor watched Tokyo Ghoul yet (I'm waiting on Shiro to release Root A), but that seems to be what is said around the internet about the show. Root A was pretty much panned by everyone.

 

Noragami is another PTW for me and it's another show that I'm waiting on Shiro for S2 on (same with Magi S2 as well). kek. See the pattern?

 

Currently watching Zetman, but next on my list just depends on my mood when the time comes, as whenever I make plans to watch x-show, when I get around to having time to do so, my mood changes and I usually end up picking something else off my list. Recently finished Terror in Resonance & Black Bullet though so making at least some headway on my backlog. Though it seems to grow faster than I manage to remove stuff from it.

 

Anyhow from your PTW list I'd recommend you watch Basilisk, but you've got a lot of great stuff listed there that you should get to like Berserk, Witch Hunter Robin, Gungrave, Soul Eater (even though 39-End was anime-original), Kanon (which I'm working on releasing), Summer Wars, Escaflowne, etc.

[Catar]

3 minutes ago, Koby said:

From what I understand, seems Tokyo Ghoul veered off into anime-original by the end of S1, which left S2 pretty much all anime-original, or in other words basically filler. Now don't hold me to that as I haven't read the source material nor watched Tokyo Ghoul yet (I'm waiting on Shiro to release Root A), but that seems to be what is said around the internet about the show. Root A was pretty much panned by everyone.

 

Noragami is another PTW for me and it's another show that I'm waiting on Shiro for S2 on (same with Magi S2 as well). kek. See the pattern?

 

Currently watching Zetman, but next on my list just depends on my mood when the time comes, as whenever I make plans to watch x-show, when I get around to having time to do so, my mood changes and I usually end up picking something else off my list. Recently finished Terror in Resonance & Black Bullet though so making at least some headway on my backlog. Though it seems to grow faster than I manage to remove stuff from it.

 

Anyhow from your PTW list I'd recommend you watch Basilisk, but you've got a lot of great stuff listed there that you should get to like Berserk, Witch Hunter Robin, Gungrave, Soul Eater (even though 39-End was anime-original), Kanon (which I'm working on releasing), Summer Wars, Escaflowne, etc.

 

I understand the roots of the term, but I really dislike referring to anime-original content as filler. It'd seem to me that filler should really refer to any content that doesn't affect the main story arc or develop characters in any way. ie: Episodes that are never referenced again outside their arcs. 

 

That's just my opinion though. 

 

Noragami I'm also waiting on Shiro for S02, but I thought I'd go ahead with S01 since it's out and MK told me to =P Once I hit the end of the season I'll break and jump to something else. Basilisk I've been meaning to watch for a long time, but weren't you doing an encode of it? I feel like I was waiting on that, but I seem to have lost the thread.

[(AC)]

I'd recommend, Spice and Wolf if not all ready seen.

[Catar]

6 minutes ago, (AC) said:

I'd recommend, Spice and Wolf if not all ready seen.

Already watched. Pretty great show actually, if a bit meandering at times. If only it had an actual ending, I'd love it so much more. There's some emotional closure to be had at the end of S02, but it still feels like the main arc had yet to really ramp up. I want more.

 

My MAL link is right there...