Trails In The Sky: SC

[Zemekis]

 

Now that Dave has finished FC & the conversation over on that thread has firmly gone off-topic, I thought it was time to make a thread for SC. I'll try to re-center the discussion a bit and focus on the game this time  

Since this thread is for the 2nd game, I'm going to say that FC spoilers are fair game. For whoever is reading this in the far-flung future, finish FC before jumping in here!

Personally, it's a toss-up for me between FC & SC for which I like better. I adore the quaint feeling of FC (most of it, at least. The ending isn't so cozy), kind of slowly putting the band together and lazily meandering around Liberl. SC, I feel, hits the gas pedal and infrequently lets up. Not only is it significantly longer & more action-packed, but the events happen at a faster rate. A lot of fan-favorite characters are introduced in this title + important events for the series. While the coup d'état in FC was important, it really only had localized impact in the scheme of things. The later events of this game are farther reaching. I won't go on & on in this OP, I just want to kick things off. Maybe Dave will grace us soon with some progress updates.

[Dave55811]

17 hours ago, Zemekis said:

Now that Dave has finished FC & the conversation over on that thread has firmly gone off-topic,

Eh?  I don't think it went off-topic....aside from me having announced that I beat the game and ordered Zero, Azure, Cold Steels I & II, though supposedly that meme image I shared rustled some jimmies or two.  Maybe that turned some people off because they cringed.  I don't know.

 

But anyway, concerning my progress in Trails SC, just now I completed two side-quests at Ruan, one of which I have yet to report back on; those side-quests involved exterminating some monsters.  There are two more side-quests to do, but it sounds like I have to wait on them, at least one of them.  The other side-quest involves getting ingredients....as such, this is one of those moments where I will be killing some monsters, which may lead to grinding.

 

17 hours ago, Zemekis said:

Since this thread is for the 2nd game, I'm going to say that FC spoilers are fair game.

Oh my God; the shit I have to say about how it all went down....

 

....the Intelligence Division was behind a lot of shit that transpired throughout the game, under the leadership of Colonel Richards.  Colonel Richards' intentions were rooted in patriotism, but had he succeeded, it would've been bad overall for Liberl....good thing Cassius suddenly jumped in, and it sounds like he's going drain the swamp....or, more accurately, give the military leadership an overhaul.  Oh, but the Intelligence Division's shenanigans were just one thing.  Professor Alba made his appearance...you know, that token-like character, that guy who is some kind of archetype of being well-intentioned but getting our heroes into a mess.  Well, as it turns out, Professor Alba played us all like a damn fiddle.....for he is one of the seven Snake Disciples, an Anguis, named "Weissmann".  His powers were revealed, and Joshua was the subject.  What Joshua experienced bore a similarity to Kurt's condition; Kurt has amnesia, and he seems to have trouble specifically with trying to recall who or what it was that messed with his memory.  However, Joshua has a dark secret.  I sensed at the start of the game that Joshua being taken into the Bright household seemed curious, but I didn't want to make assumptions.  At the end of the game, my suspicions received some confirmation, though I put it bluntly, and perhaps inaccurately, when I conclude my suspicions by declaring "Joshua is a killing machine".  Joshua is a "human weapon", a protege of Weissmann; he was trained to be an "enforcer".  But, with titles like "Enforcer" and "Anguis", as well as "Snake Disciple", just what the hell is going on?  Well, there is a group of people there, operating behind the scenes, like a secret society....there are those out there who know the name of this society to be "Ouroboros"...

 

....and so that sets things up for Trails SC.  Estelle is looking for Joshua, but she is determined to fight this secret society if she has to.  May God (er, Aidios) keep her safe, because we all know that taking on secret societies and shadowy organizations is like going up against The Almighty.  You can't fight them, and if you do, you will experience a fate worse than death.  At least, that's how it is in real-life....and, er, I really shouldn't be making comparisons with real-life.  It's just a game.

 

But yeah.  Trails SC is going good so far.  It's still a bit slow to start, though certainly not as slow as Trails FC was to start.  In fact, I think I'm understanding how TitS is a "filter".  Most people wouldn't want to start by playing Trails FC, because Trails FC is, to paraphrase @Zemekis, a slow burn.  But, once you finish the game, TitS pretty much has that stranglehold on you (or is it just me?), and you'll want to pick up Trails SC and continue the story.  Best of all, if you did every side-quest and achieved 368BP, and you saved the clear data, you can transfer it over to Trails SC and get some goodies, like a new Quartz.  Also, Estelle's stats carry over, so if you were Lv.39 at the end of Trails FC, you'll be Lv.39 when starting Trails SC....but, don't get too comfy with that, because enemies you fight early on can deal hundreds of HP in damage, and you won't get much ExP out of winning fights.  But, going back to the "filter" thing.....I won't be filtered.

[Zemekis]

20 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

Eh?  I don't think it went off-topic....

 

I mean with Koby & I going back & forth on the differences between platform releases for Zero & Azure...in the FC thread.

 

20 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

But, with titles like "Enforcer" and "Anguis", as well as "Snake Disciple", just what the hell is going on?  Well, there is a group of people there, operating behind the scenes, like a secret society....there are those out there who know the name of this society to be "Ouroboros"...

 

....and so that sets things up for Trails SC.  Estelle is looking for Joshua, but she is determined to fight this secret society if she has to.  May God (er, Aidios) keep her safe, because we all know that taking on secret societies and shadowy organizations is like going up against The Almighty.  You can't fight them, and if you do, you will experience a fate worse than death. 

 

SC certainly goes places. It's quite the bulky adventure. I recall that my playtime was quite high, so yours may be astronomical since you manage to quadruple (or more) my playtime on most games we both try out. SC is considered to be one of the longer games in the series, but certainly not the longest. I can't speak for them yet, but I've heard that Cold Steel III or IV (can't remember which) is a doozy. I remember fans saying that about Cold Steel II when it came out in English. That it was so insurmountably long  only to be immediately outdone by III or IV. I'm getting off-topic again. The Ouroboros stuff in the Trails series is my favorite. The organization is mysterious enough to keep me interested, and they give me tidbits of information often enough to stay engaged. Sometimes you will be waiting quite a while for new info on them, however.

 

20 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

It's still a bit slow to start, though certainly not as slow as Trails FC was to start.  In fact, I think I'm understanding how TitS is a "filter".  Most people wouldn't want to start by playing Trails FC, because Trails FC is, to paraphrase @Zemekis, a slow burn.  But, once you finish the game, TitS pretty much has that stranglehold on you (or is it just me?), and you'll want to pick up Trails SC and continue the story.  Best of all, if you did every side-quest and achieved 368BP, and you saved the clear data, you can transfer it over to Trails SC and get some goodies, like a new Quartz.  Also, Estelle's stats carry over, so if you were Lv.39 at the end of Trails FC, you'll be Lv.39 when starting Trails SC....but, don't get too comfy with that, because enemies you fight early on can deal hundreds of HP in damage, and you won't get much ExP out of winning fights.  But, going back to the "filter" thing.....I won't be filtered.

FC is slow & a filter for Zoomers (or just people who aren't serious about cozying up with a long JRPG). I know that the way the game looks causes some people to bounce off it as well. IF you do make it through, then you're in. The hook at the end of FC is so strong that it's almost impossible to not jump directly into SC unless you're old school like me and SC wasn't available in English yet! I played FC on PSP at release  then waited years for SC. That's a whole story in itself, but since this is the SC thread maybe I'll find a write-up or video to share regarding the localization of SC/the 3rd. For years it wasn't known if Xseed would be able to release SC. 

The carryover levels from FC -> SC are helpful. The enemies at the beginning of SC are well known amongst the fanbase. They hit like a truck & for people who skipped FC, they get spanked. I think Estelle's level only carries over up to 40. Beyond that (which would be hard to achieve anyway) is thrown out. Also, orbments are thrown away at the start of every game for one reason or another. I'm glad you feel like you're "in" now and you're digging into the meat of the story with SC. Relatively speaking you're still at the beginning, but SC is certainly the real stuff. The characters are mostly pre-established, so there isn't time spent on that. Events roll out at a better pace & now that setup is done it's time for payoff. Especially in the latter half of the game. I look forward to more of your updates! You texted me an update this afternoon, but I can't comment on it until you're done hunting the "ghost" because it'd spoil you. You'll be meeting someone important 

[Dave55811]

My current progress, signified by a proper screenshot.  I'm not keen on using Imgur, but at least you can upload pics without having to log in.  If I logged in and tried to upload an image, it'd be denied, because I "blew it" after uploading some problematic images.  I forget which ones; this was back in about late-2013, so it was probably something anime-related, possibly a panel from WataMote, that one where Tomoko was in an infirmary and she saw a shadow with a giant boner and she thought she was going to get raped.  That might have been it.

Some Vamp shit, here.  In MGS2, Vamp had a technique where he could pin Raiden's shadow, and Raiden wouldn't be able to move.  To counter this, though, you could just shoot the lights.  Metal Gear was my raison d'etre as a gamer, so try not to be surprised, or annoyed, if I catch something in Trails that reminds me of the Metal Gear series.

 

In other news, I might need to redo Ch.I, because I missed that one Krone Trail monster extermination side-quest, thus resulting in getting 45BP, instead of 47BP.  Of course, what I mean by "redoing" isn't exactly starting all over; I have a previous save-file that's at the part where I gave that Orvid dude some ingredients....but, there is that Sapphirl Tower side-quest that I need to do all over again.  Basically, there will be a lot to do all over again, which will also include collecting items, but at least I can skip over the dialogue.

I guess this is my one main issue with the Trails games.  I can appreciate them committing to story-telling, but this is almost on par with MGS4.  This might be a personal issue, though; I certainly have experience with games that have long-ass cut-scenes, but it's been so long since I last experienced games like that, so there might be some feeling of having "moved on".  Admittedly, though, when I found out that I didn't have the max BP for Ch.I, I was getting impatient and going "Come the fuck on!" when the dialogue stretched on.  If I had all 47BP for Ch.I, maybe I would have been less angsty (or something).  Otherwise, if these games had an autoplay function for spoken dialogue, my complaints about long-ass conversations would be eased.  Until then, I'll make do.  Like I said earlier, I won't be filtered.

 

But, I'd say the real issue concerning redoing(?) Ch.I....is that I learned that it's actually possible to kill those Shining Poms, and because they yield a shit-ton of ExP (hundreds) as well as some nice accessories, I'm considering stocking up on Surprise Cookies so I can get some grinding in....because, see, whereas every other attack on them results in a miss or zero damage, Surprise Cookies actually dish the hurt out, and from what I experienced, you need to toss 2-3 Surprise Cookies at one to kill it.  Yesterday, I killed two.  This was at the Sapphirl Tower.  There are also some in the underground tunnels of the old schoolhouse at the Royal Academy, but I was running out of cookies and one that I attacked fled the battle (as they always do).

 

So, who knows?  Today, I'll be tossing my cookies.

 

EDIT/UPDATE

I must have misread and/or overreacted on something.  Even though I am technically now on Ch.II, it looks like I can still tackle any side-quests I missed.  Just now I exterminated that monster in Krone Trail.  Now there are two more side-quests at Ruan, one of which is hidden.  Once I get 54BP (the necessary amount, according to this GameFAQs guide), I'm moving on to the next location.

Edited February 6 by Dave55811
Added the "EDIT/UPDATE" part.

[Zemekis]

Nice. Glad to hear that you didn't screw yourself on BP. I think I had a similar scare because I was following the same guide, but perhaps I read a bit more thoroughly or read ahead a bit. Have you continued on to the next location? I haven't been able to write a lot, as work is busy this week. I've been playing Dungeon Encounters with my miniscule free time 

[Koby]

You probably already know this, but to get max rank in most of these games there is some leeway with BP/AP/whatever they call it in their respective game, where you can miss some stuff and still get max rank. Of course it's nice to just try to get every bit you can when you have a save capable of returning to pick up missed things, but if going back isn't something you want to do, then you're probably safe to just move on and you'll still manage to come out okay. I think one of the games had some leeway as big as like 15 extra points for example.

[Dave55811]

1 hour ago, Koby said:

You probably already know this, but to get max rank in most of these games there is some leeway with BP/AP/whatever they call it in their respective game, where you can miss some stuff and still get max rank. Of course it's nice to just try to get every bit you can when you have a save capable of returning to pick up missed things, but if going back isn't something you want to do, then you're probably safe to just move on and you'll still manage to come out okay. I think one of the games had some leeway as big as like 15 extra points for example.

I have actually noticed that some side-quests listed in the GameFAQs guide have expirations listed as '-'.  Some side-quests are listed as expiring at the end of a chapter, or during a specific moment, but still.

 

Basically, I'm going about Trails SC the same way I did Trails FC; I'm looking up and down between the gameplay and the GameFAQs guide, respectively.  Admittedly, it's not ideal for experiencing a new game series, but if I have an opportunity to "prove myself" by achieving max rank, I'm taking it.  Though, speaking of "achieving", apparently this game has achievements....but, they seem to be only for Steam and PlayStation.  I think GOG has an achievement system, but wouldn't that require GOG Galaxy?  I haven't checked that out, and I can't really be assed to check right now.  Basically, whatever the GameFAQs guide lays out, I will pursue.

 

That being said, I fucked up big time in my playthrough.  I missed the second chapter of Gambler Jack.  The earliest save file I have is the end of the Prologue, but....is this something I'm going to regret when I get started on Trails 3rd?

[Zemekis]

15 hours ago, Koby said:

there is some leeway with BP/AP/whatever they call it in their respective game

 

@Dave55811: Koby is right here, there actually is a bit of wiggle room where you don't need every single BP to get max rank. It's much more significant than I remembered, from some quick Googling, it looks like in FC you only needed 292/368 BP to reach Class 1. I think there are additional carryover bonuses between games for going higher than that, but it won't change dialogue from game to game like Class 1 Bracer does. I play JRPGs for the story, so I make sure to do all the sidequests so I experience the full story. In Trails FC -> SC it will change dialogue for some characters you helped out in FC. In SC the range appears to be much tighter with Rank A requiring 380/382 BP. 
 

11 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

Basically, I'm going about Trails SC the same way I did Trails FC; I'm looking up and down between the gameplay and the GameFAQs guide, respectively. 

 

Since I more or less only play RPGs I've kinda gotten used to playing them that way. It would be nice to fully immerse myself and not have to consult a guide, but the fact is you will miss things if you don't use one. If that matters to you, then a guide is the only way. And GameFAQs is how you do it if you aren't a Zoomer. I fully understand not wanting to tab back and forth between a game and GameFAQs or printouts, but at times it's just a necessary evil of games this complex.

 

11 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

I think GOG has an achievement system, but wouldn't that require GOG Galaxy?  I haven't checked that out, and I can't really be assed to check right now.  Basically, whatever the GameFAQs guide lays out, I will pursue.

 

That being said, I fucked up big time in my playthrough.  I missed the second chapter of Gambler Jack.  The earliest save file I have is the end of the Prologue, but....is this something I'm going to regret when I get started on Trails 3rd?

 

Idk about chievos, not really my thing. If you can't be assed then I can't either. Never really messed with Galaxy too much.

 

I think you're screwed on the best weapon(s) then, but it's not like the final dungeon will be impossible or anything like that. I think some of the Trails games allow for you to get a few books you miss(?), but SC isn't one of them. If I were you, I would not reset back to the prologue. It won't affect the 3rd. Weapons don't carry forward, so you're fine. In fact, I don't think levels carry forward between SC -> 3rd for reasons I don't wish to spoil.

 

.......I looked it up for you, the only carryover bonuses between SC -> 3rd are based on your Bracer rank. They are as follows:

 

thus, reaching 380/382 BP is far more important if you care about carryover bonuses than collecting all the books for Zemurian Ore. Hopefully that helps.

[Dave55811]

5 hours ago, Zemekis said:

GameFAQs is how you do it if you aren't a Zoomer. I fully understand not wanting to tab back and forth between a game and GameFAQs or printouts, but at times it's just a necessary evil of games this complex.

Aaaah; too true.  I'm still an older breed of gamer.  Back then we had to read books (magazines, Nintendo Player's Guides, what-have-you) if we wanted to get more out of our games.  Given what Trails is, these GameFAQs are essential.

 

All things considered, though, I hope the more recent Trails games won't require that I print out a walkthrough.  Being able to immerse yourself without worrying about missing a whole lot would be a nice change of pace.

 

5 hours ago, Zemekis said:

......I looked it up for you, the only carryover bonuses between SC -> 3rd are based on your Bracer rank. They are as follows:

thus, reaching 380/382 BP is far more important if you care about carryover bonuses than collecting all the books for Zemurian Ore. Hopefully that helps.

This certainly clears away any stress.  I was ready to just take my L's and power on through.  It seems like, now, I have a clear understanding of what all carries over throughout the OG Trails trilogy, and BP seems to be it.  All the more reason to prioritize BP acquisition, methinks.

[Zemekis]

7 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

I hope the more recent Trails games won't require that I print out a walkthrough.

Require? No, I did them without a walkthrough. But if you want to get the most out of them...walkthrough.

7 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

This certainly clears away any stress.

Glad I could help!

[Nekone]

As somebody who's completed all 3 The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky games, the two games (chronologically speaking) that take place after those (Trails from Zero and Trails to Azure), AND the first two Trails of Cold Steel games...let me just say that there is SO much more to unravel, so much more going on that you've yet to discover. I'm on Cold Steel III already.

 

The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky series starts off a whole series of events that will, one by one, unfold as-yet-undiscovered plots over the course of each subsequent arc after that. I highly encourage you to enjoy Trails in the Sky SC, enjoy the story, the gameplay, AND THE SOUNDTRACK (you better have the BGM volume up), because this franchise will have so much more to offer once you finish these first 3.

[Dave55811]

On 2/8/2024 at 9:51 PM, Zemekis said:

Require? No, I did them without a walkthrough. But if you want to get the most out of them...walkthrough.

Oh; I thought the later Trails games would have some kind of "hand-holding" thing.  Maybe not explicitly "hand-holding", but rather a way of tracking side-quests and something that warns you that you'll abandon a side-quest if you progress further at some point.  As for "later Trails games", I'd think some time after Trails 3rd....but, I wouldn't know, because I haven't looked up anything pertaining to these games, out of fear of spoilage.

 

On 2/9/2024 at 10:26 AM, Nekone said:

As somebody who's completed all 3 The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky games, the two games (chronologically speaking) that take place after those (Trails from Zero and Trails to Azure), AND the first two Trails of Cold Steel games...let me just say that there is SO much more to unravel, so much more going on that you've yet to discover. I'm on Cold Steel III already.

 

The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky series starts off a whole series of events that will, one by one, unfold as-yet-undiscovered plots over the course of each subsequent arc after that. I highly encourage you to enjoy Trails in the Sky SC, enjoy the story, the gameplay, AND THE SOUNDTRACK (you better have the BGM volume up), because this franchise will have so much more to offer once you finish these first 3.

Indeed.  I was briefed by @Zemekis some months back about how in-depth the Trails series is.  Story-wise, a lot of things are connected, so I can expect some consistencies....though, I may forget some characters here and there.

 

Speaking of Trails from Zero & Trails to Azure, I discovered that there are US versions...at least a US version of Trails to Azure.  However, I'm tempted to just get the EU versions, just to play it safe; I understand that some translators & dubbers here in the West have tried slipping in some neo-progressive jargon and/or similar bullshit, and I don't want any of that shit in my Trails games.  The EU versions feature Japanese audio with English subtitles....a description not shared in the US versions (according to Play-Asia's pages).

 

Would the EU versions of Zero & Azure be a safe bet overall?  For the record, I'm getting them for the Switch, because I was told the PS4 versions lack certain features that the Switch has.  Also, for future reference, is there some source online where I can determine if a localized game is pozzed** or not?  I think it would be convenient for all of us if I was given a reference, because I realize I'm starting to be an annoyance when I have to ask someone else, and I should really figure these things out myself....thus, a reliable website would be most helpful.

 

** = "Pozzed", as in "AIDS positive", a phrase used by certain circles in California, specifically "bug chasers".  "Pozzed", in this context, would refer to works that have been corrupted by neo-progressive agendas, such as anime-themed games having fan-service edited out, or dialogue being changed to incorporate socio-political references.  Actually, I think people here know what the word means, but just in case, I felt like pointing it out, like say if someone asks.

[Nekone]

12 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

Speaking of Trails from Zero & Trails to Azure, I discovered that there are US versions...at least a US version of Trails to Azure.  However, I'm tempted to just get the EU versions, just to play it safe; I understand that some translators & dubbers here in the West have tried slipping in some neo-progressive jargon and/or similar bullshit, and I don't want any of that shit in my Trails games.  The EU versions feature Japanese audio with English subtitles....a description not shared in the US versions (according to Play-Asia's pages).

 

The versions of those two games that I played had Japanese audio with English subtitles, and those were the Steam versions on PC. I haven't actually played any of the Switch versions as 95% of my gaming is done entirely on PC (though I do own a Switch and do play games on it, e.g the usual fare of Mariokart 8 Deluxe, Super Smash Bros Deluxe etc. and a few others like Xenoblade Chronicles 2 and 3, but I digress as that'd be going off-topic). The choice is always yours of course, and plenty of topics abound about the voice acting and localization and all that stuff in both Zero and Azure, but again the version I had was the one with JP VA + ENG subs though I'm almost certain that wasn't the EU version.

 

TL;DR: You shouldn't have any issue playing the US version of it; the version of Trails from Zero on Steam (PC) has an overall rating of 'Overwhelmingly positive' so I don't think anyone has any real issues with how the game was localized for the West at least, if nothing else it'd probably be fans really wanting the ENG dubbing that they heard during battles in the Trails in the Sky series but NISA/Falcom kinda failing to deliver on that.

[Koby]

Pretty sure the EU version is literally just the US version with the difference being the PEGI rating instead of ESRB on the cover. I know for sure there is only two English translations in existence: Geofronts fan translation and NISAs official translation which is based upon Geofronts but fixed up and the added Kai scenes added to it, etc. Because the Geofront translation was for an entirely different build of the game. Well there was an even older translation known as "Flame Edit" or whatever... but heck that was half finished and not really thoroughly edited... and it became the base for what Geofront did, so it's largely forgotten about. In any event, NISAs translation is the only English translation that would've made it onto any official console version of the game in any country.

 

And so called fans like to lie and blow changes out of the water... Like they'll shit on NISA for certain liberties taken but ignore how XSEED and Geofront both took way more liberties with their edits. Personally I've yet to see a change that was actually outright bad or even "censorship" as those folks like to scream. Most of these people crying about them are made cause it's not 1:1 word for word, but that is never how translation works unless you're desiring the end result to read robotic-like with broken English. The type of changes they're mostly crying about happen in pretty much any translation. I spent over 15 years in the anime fansub scene and what I've seen is just business as usual. And the machine translations they praise for future titles are awful.. with missing dialogue, broken English, and wooden delivery. Seems like no one with a high school level of grammar knowledge actually looked over it after running the lines through Google Translator and slapping it onto the "fan patch" as is. I've dealt with these haters on the Steam forums for the last 3 years and they're growing in numbers because people generally just accept what they say without questioning it... or they'll see some comparisons between NISA and the Machine TL and without knowing any better, assume the MTL is somehow superior because of whatever opinions they formed outside of actually having any knowledge in Japanese language or translations.

 

I don't like pushing woke idealology and political agenda shoving down our throats in media... so if the games actually had stuff that fell in that viewpoint, I'd definitely have something to say about it. But I've yet to see any conclusive evidence that any changes made to the script were for censorship or political agenda pushing... and I've played through the games doing everything you can do in them. The main comparison made in this argument is about one scene where they're talking about women being in the kitchen or something to the effect and in NISAs version they say something to the effect that she's great in the kitchen or at cooking. I'd have to find the actual comparison they parade around claiming it fits their narrative... but to me honestly that is a huge stretch and in no way the censorship against "women" that the people throwing a fit about it seem to think it is.

[Dave55811]

Well, I was about to place an order on both Zero & Azure (EU), but the Deluxe Edition for one of them (Trails to Azure) is sold out.  I'm thinking of holding off for now.  I want both Deluxe Editions.  I think there will be a restock, but it doesn't say when on their page.  At least, I hope they restock.

 

1 hour ago, Koby said:

I don't like pushing woke idealology and political agenda shoving down our throats in media...

Me neither.  I think you'll find me speaking quite ill of woke, neo-progressive BS being injected into our media.

 

A long time ago, the problem with translation and dubbing was that the English voice-acting was just cringey.  At least everything was done word-for-word, though, because nowadays it's going as far as changing subtitles.  I remember seeing "dotard" in the subtitles in an episode of Attack on Titan S3....though, in fairness, a lot of changes in subtitles I encounter seem to involve implementation of pop-cultural jargon, like Nagatoro-san and how the subs included "sus".....but, to that, whereas everybody else is thinking "Fortnite", I was thinking "Conker's Bad Fur Day".  I'm sorry, but I'm that old.  Other than that, there's subtitles in anime with dialogue like "I'm mad salty!" or implementing the term "gigachad" and stuff.  I understand that Japanese language doesn't utilize conversational styles like "I'm mad salty!" or something like that, and that "gigachad" isn't part of their slang vocabulary; maybe the translators took liberties when translating a character saying "I'm very angry," or whatever it was.  Sometimes, anime gets translated in a way that is cohesive with the average demographic that consumes anime.  Of course, that demographic has changed recently.  Thus, most of the time, Western translation will produce cringe.

 

As for how this ties into the Trails games (so as to stay on topic here), I can only speak for Trails FC and Trails SC.  I've caught some dialogue referencing stuff touching upon how "women shouldn't lead", and at one point in Trails SC, something about "far-right extremists opposing the pact".  But, I have reason to believe that was all part of the original Japanese script, that it wasn't something changed by Western translators.  Wasn't this game translated two decades ago?  That was from a time before [CURRENT YEAR] (which would be either 2012 or 2015**...or perhaps 2009?), so I'm not exactly fretting over the dialogue presented in the game.  If this game was translated after the epoch of [CURRENT YEAR], I'd sneer at it.  But, overall, I'm confident that the OG Trails trilogy doesn't have woke shit.

 

1 hour ago, Koby said:

I spent over 15 years in the anime fansub scene and what I've seen is just business as usual. And the machine translations they praise for future titles are awful.. with missing dialogue, broken English, and wooden delivery. Seems like no one with a high school level of grammar knowledge actually looked over it after running the lines through Google Translator and slapping it onto the "fan patch" as is.

Seems like something I'd do, to be honest.....using Google Translate to find out what the Japanese text reads out as.  I can't speak Japanese, nor can I read it.  The least I could do is try to make the sentence-structure be more coherent, but honestly, it's better than giving it to official Western translators, who will just shit it all up with their politics.  Oh, but AI; you ever hear about AI coming into the picture?  AI is bad and all, but at least it can translate Japanese to English most effectively.

 

** = 2015 would seem most apt, because that's the year when Canadian PM Trudeau, pretty much, popularized the term; when he was asked why there should be more women in government (or whatever), he said "Because it's 2015."  Since then, it had become a meme.  But, the reason I mention 2012 is because, besides Occupy Wall Street being taken over by aposematic-haired neo-progressive clowns, there might have been supernatural and/or metaphysical occurrences....sadly, none of this can be proven.  As for 2009, this is something one "Lunar Archivist" hinted at one time to me, something about the Obama Administration's involvement in letting some criminal off the hook....but, I forget all that.

[Koby]

Yes, the translations for Sky 1-3 and Cold Steel 1-2 were done quite a many years ago. I'd have to look it up for specific dates. But XSEED lost the publishing rights to the series so NISA took over starting with Cold Steel 3 and they went back and filled in the missing gap with Zero & Azure which XSEED had skipped doing initially for a few various reasons initially and for whatever reason never went back to. Though when NISA took over the series in the west, several key members responsible for the series at XSEED actually were brought on board to continue their work under NISA. Even most of the voice actors were brought over (though there are a couple that had to be changed due to scheduling issues or union agreements).

[Dave55811]

On 2/13/2024 at 5:36 PM, Koby said:

Yes, the translations for Sky 1-3 and Cold Steel 1-2 were done quite a many years ago. I'd have to look it up for specific dates. But XSEED lost the publishing rights to the series so NISA took over starting with Cold Steel 3 and they went back and filled in the missing gap with Zero & Azure which XSEED had skipped doing initially for a few various reasons initially and for whatever reason never went back to.

I took a look on Wikipedia and it seems like the OG Trails trilogy was translated recently.....by "recently", I mean within a decade.  Xseed acquired the rights to the trilogy in 2010.

 

It's rather curious, because I encountered this a couple days ago:

....and the whole fiddle thing would've been circa 2014, because this game.  I'm not complaining, though; I thought this was amusing.

 

I guess the history of localization of the Trails series is something I don't know better about.  TitS has been around for almost two decades, and then starting in 2010 we would just start bringing it over here.  However, I was assured by @Zemekis that the OG TitS trilogy dialogue (at least Trails FC & Trails SC) has no woke shit.  And, I think I said it before, but I heard that Nihon Falcom will step in if our localizers try to sneak in some unwanted shit.  Hopefully they will continue to do so.

 

All I know of Xseed is that they brought over Akiba's Trip: Undead & Undressed.  I played that game on the PS4 in 2015, with the default English language.  No problems, but I remember Japanese media not being parasitized at the time; that would happen in 2018.  In fact, in recent years, I recall Raging Golden Eagle saying in a video that Marvelous, Inc., the parent company of Xseed, had become parasitized.  Marvelous, Inc. is listed as the publisher for Trails of Cold Steel I & II.  As for NISA (NIS America?), I can't say I know much about them.  They published Trails from Zero & Trails to Azure in the West, at least.  Again, though, and also to reference Cold Steel I & II, I was assured by the aforementioned subject in the previous paragraph that the Trails games aren't pozzed.

 

On 2/13/2024 at 5:36 PM, Koby said:

Though when NISA took over the series in the west, several key members responsible for the series at XSEED actually were brought on board to continue their work under NISA. Even most of the voice actors were brought over (though there are a couple that had to be changed due to scheduling issues or union agreements).

Hmm.  Fascinating.  Sounds like commitment....or maybe NISA wanted the ones experienced in translating the dialogue, which I understood was quite a harrowing ordeal.  Translation of Trails FC took about 3/4 of a year, with 72-hour weeks.  They probably gave them a better offer, but I don't know.  Regardless, translation of the Trails games is no task for rookies.

 

As for the voice-actors, I could(n't?) care less, since I plan to play through this series with the Japanese voice-acting.

[Zemekis]

16 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

I was assured by @Zemekis that the OG TitS trilogy dialogue (at least Trails FC & Trails SC) has no woke shit.

 

Not as far as I've played. I'm as far as Nekone, I'll be starting Cold Steel III when I return from my trip next month. I'm getting the PS5 re-release/remaster that includes both III & IV. No 'woke' stuff isn't to say that there won't be anything you disagree with, I'm just saying that there aren't any objective examples of agenda pushing that's external to the games. Joshua crossdressing in FC for example...I see that as a goofy segment played for laughs similar to Wall Market in FF7. Nothing to get angry over, but I could see some players hitting the brakes there and going "woah woah woah, you said no woke stuff!" The context & how it's played off matter a lot, in my opinion. In one of the later games, there is an anti-immigration faction that are played off as minor, supporting villains for a brief time. I empathize with what they're saying (obviously not the terrorism part) but I didn't let it bend me out of shape. There are many, many factions & allegiances within Trails, and because each arc takes place in a different country you often get to see the perspective of the 'bad guys', which I appreciate. Hell, in the third arc you play as a party of

Spoiler

Erebonians

who are treated as the de facto enemies of Western Zemuria. There's certainly never comes a moment when the cast looks at the camera and reminds you to take your UN-mandated high fructose corn syrup vaccine & salute the pride flag. You'd have to be trying really hard to get offended by anything in Trails, unless you're a Kotaku-style journo. I think they got mad about the hot springs scenes a few times.

 

16 hours ago, Dave55811 said:

As for the voice-actors, I could(n't?) care less, since I plan to play through this series with the Japanese voice-acting.

You may be scoring a double-win here. Not only are you getting into the series shortly after the Crossbell games received official localization, but you should be able to play Cold Steel with Japanese audio. I played CS I & II on PS3 which only came with English voice acting. I think the later releases of CS I & II have a Japanese voice option? I haven't double-dipped to find out.

[Koby]

5 hours ago, Zemekis said:

You may be scoring a double-win here. Not only are you getting into the series shortly after the Crossbell games received official localization, but you should be able to play Cold Steel with Japanese audio. I played CS I & II on PS3 which only came with English voice acting. I think the later releases of CS I & II have a Japanese voice option? I haven't double-dipped to find out.

Yes, initially XSEED didn't manage to get the license for Japanese audio for CS1 & CS2, so the money they intended to spend on obtaining that, they instead spent voicing an additional 5,000 lines in English that weren't voiced at all in the Japanese audio. Then later they did actually manage to go ahead and license the Japanese audio and it was added to the re-releases and updated on PC. Which means now you can play all games with Japanese audio... but the English audio for those two games has more voiced lines than the Japanese audio and in the Sky trilogy the Japanese voices have to be modded in as the PC version of the game wasn't voiced, the audio for voices came from the EVO builds of the game that was on PSP? so modders made a way to add that to the PC build. I doubt if the Sky trilogy does end up on consoles that it'd have the voices either. As for playing in English, the Sky trilogy was only voiced for like battle banters, then Crossbell wasn't dubbed at all... But CS1-CS4, Reverie, and all future games have English voice acting... and imo it's really well done.

[Dave55811]

5 hours ago, Zemekis said:

You'd have to be trying really hard to get offended by anything in Trails, unless you're a Kotaku-style journo.

Honestly, from what I'm experiencing, to make assumptions that the games are injecting political shit would require real reaching.  All dialogue I've encountered in the games so far has been within the context of the game's story.  I've caught some dialogue that referenced sexism, particularly the Doop (er, Duke) speaking low of Kloe, but not only did I not assume Westerners tried sneaking something in, but I also thought "Based."

 

I'm not really offended by anything in the Trails games....probably because I'm an old-timer.  But, above all else, I haven't really detected any socio-political injections in the dialogue, either.
 

6 hours ago, Zemekis said:

Joshua crossdressing in FC for example...I see that as a goofy segment played for laughs similar to Wall Market in FF7.

Joshua was so pretty. Oops.

 

But yeah; that moment was funny.  Now that you mention it, I'd hate to see how that would be tried in [CURRENT YEAR].  I vaguely remember some moments from the OG FF7, and I think lots of it was left out in FF7R.  But overall, FF7R's moment of Cloud having to cross-dress didn't really strike me as something agenda-driven (at least compared to Judgment's dub of the scene with whats-her-name having to dress up to meet some boss)....except that I could imagine normies and Kotaku-types experiencing it and writing socio-political pieces about it.  I'd hate to see what they write about over this moment in Trails FC.  We can always just tell them to fuck off, but.....or, best-case scenario is that they wouldn't play this game, because it's old and it'd take them a year to reach this scene.